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Greene County, Indiana ~ Monday, September 8, 2008
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Cageless chicken eggs? Are you serious?
Posted Friday, April 11, 2008, at 3:52 PM<< Previous | Read comments | Respond | Email link | Next >>
Call me "old fashion," "set in my ways" or just plain stubborn, but I have a real problem accepting this organic food kick we hear so much about these days.
You venture out to your local grocery store and what do you see on the shelves, in the produce bins and in the refrigerated compartments? Organic foods. All kinds of them. Fruits, vegetables, grains, eggs, dairy products and even meats. The word "organic" simply refers to the way farmers grow and process these agricultural products. "Organic farming practices are designed to encourage soil and water conservation and reduce pollution. Farmers who grow organic produce and meat don't use conventional methods to fertilize, control weeds or prevent livestock disease. For example, rather than using chemical weed killers, organic farmers conduct sophisticated crop rotations and spread mulch or manure to keep weeds at bay," according to the Mayo Clinic's Web site. Products that are completely organic -- such as fruits, vegetables, eggs or other single-ingredient foods -- are labeled 100 percent organic and can carry a small USDA seal. Foods that have more than one ingredient, such as breakfast cereal, can use the USDA organic seal on their package labels, depending on the number of organic ingredients. Foods containing less than 70 percent organic ingredients can't use the organic seal or the word "organic" on their product label. They can include the organic items in their ingredient list. In my view, these organic goodies look the same as the conventional versions, probably taste the same and cost significantly more. The higher prices are due to more expensive farming practices, tighter government regulations and lower crop yields. Because organic farmers don't use herbicides or pesticides, many management tools that control weeds and pests are labor intensive -- and more costly, according to Mayo Clinic researchers. For example, organic growers may hand weed vegetables to control weeds, and you may end up paying more for these vegetables. You may see other terms on food labels, such as "all-natural," "free-range" or "hormone-free." Again, is there really any difference in these products from the way generations before us have prepared our grown foods and livestock? My sweet youngster daughter drew my attention a couple weeks back when I discovered that she was using "free range" or "cageless" eggs as I was about to prepare breakfast during a visit. Please don't try and tell me that a free range or a egg produced by cageless chicken is really any different than a conventional egg. The only difference is the price -- which is more than a dollar higher per dozen. I have to admit, that's just smart marketing if you ask me. Some animal activists are campaigning for a "free range" egg and poultry industry as the first step toward ending egg production, which is one of the first steps toward ending animal agriculture altogether as we know it. It is a big ploy to end farming and ag practices as we known them. An interesting sidelight was pointed out by my son-in-law who wondered how much more difficult it would be for farmers to gather "free range" eggs rather than their caged counterparts. He likened it to a huge Easter egg hunt. Good point. Also, USDA officials tell us there is no conclusive evidence that organic food is more nutritious or safer than conventionally grown food. The USDA also suggests that organic fruits and vegetables spoil faster because they are not treated with waxes or preservatives. Also, you expect less-than-perfect appearances in some organic produce -- odd shapes, varying colors and perhaps smaller sizes. Still, some people contend they can taste the difference between organic and non-organic food. Others say they find no difference. Taste is a very subjective, so I guess you'll have decide for yourself. For me, I'm not buying the organic stuff. Call me stubborn or stupid, I don't care. At breakfast tomorrow, just dish me up a couple of good, old-fashion caged eggs, a heaping helping of German fried potatoes loaded with onions with a couple of pork sausage patties from a conventional Hoosier farm-raised hog on the side.
Nick is assistant editor for the Greene County Daily World. He can be reached by telephone at 847-4487 or 1-800-947-4487 or by e-mail at nschneider@gcdailyworld.com or schneider.nick@gmail.com Comments Showing most recent comments first [Show in chronological order instead] |
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and the hysteria grows!!!!
from the wall street journal 4/25/08
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB12088151...
from the ap news wire...
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080425/ap_o...
world wide famine..but I do not want that egg. I am to good to eat one of them.
mother2- I thank you for your husbands service and agent orange was very toxic.
I respect your opinion.
I am looking for information to find out where this horrible destruction of people is taking place. What people are dying from poison and antibiotics? It is important that this knowledge get out to more of the public.
Please link me to any articles that state where and when these atrocities are taking place.
I respect your opinion, I would just like some source information to back up your claims.
To green county patriot--My husband was a Vietnam Veteran & I'll thank you to not call me "paranoid" about agent orange!!! Its what he did for this country that gives you the right to say what you want!! I did not say they were in eggs-only all the pesticides and antibiotics are!! All this is destroying this planet full of people-at least in the USA!! People have to make their own choices in what they eat and how they live their lives.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/apps/pbcs...
Okay one more headline(from today) if anyone even cares....which they wont until the walmart out here does not have what they want.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/apps/pbcs......
So good luck and God bless and I hope it is all hype over nothing.
I know what will save us. Raise minimum wage!
So long dollar value menu....
Stuff like this is so scary.
http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/bu...
Headline: Era of cheap food ends!
Of course as Americans we want to squabble over the details of our food because we are spoiled..keep driving those prices up by demanding more regulation! That makes it so poor people can not buy as much when they go to the store. How about the effects on the elderly too? I guess we do not care about them eating either.
this all must be a good thing because some one somewhere thinks that I should not eat as much anyway. Just like I should be cold in the winter to save the environment.
How about this headline from todays news also.
http://www.reuters.com/article/marketsNe...
What does it matter, we do not eat much rice? We burn food here for fuel even though there is oil all over the place. The apathy in this country makes me sick.
What do cows eat? what is the price of beef doing? I forgot beef is bad. But I soon wont be able to get rice. I should not buy the eggs either? so what can I eat? What should I feed the kids? I cant afford the gas to go to the grocery either and my garden wont come in until fall (which is not organic by the way because the feds have not been out to inspect it)
Then this headline just rocks me.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/main.jh...
Biofuels make millions homeless...wow!
What happens when we all go to war over these shortages? What will that do to the environment.
I say bring on the GMO's! Feed the hungry. Burn more coal! Put the poor to work and keep the elderly warm. Stop meddling with a system that was working but, with all this making a difference, is now 8^.
Heaven forbid we use technology to improve yields so that we grow enough food to feed everyone. That would be horrible!
..the environmentalists and commies have won: food rationing in the united states. Now we will only eat what they think is good for us....or only what they let us have.
http://nysun.com/news/food-rationing-con...
Plants have rights too!
If you continue to call your garden organic without approval from the proper authorities I will be forced to call 911 or email Oprah and get a show done about how horribly abusive you are to the plants you are growing.
Does your garden have official status as organic by the usda? If not I would refrain from using that term to describe what you are growing.
Guess it's time to try my hand at growing our family organics. Although with the japanese beetles as thick as they are on flowering plants, that sounds like a tall order.
To be labled organic you must be certified. You might be able to say it was grown with organic methods or say it is natural. That is about it.
To be labled organic you must be certified. You might be able to say it was grown with organic methods or say it is natural. That is about it.
I do not see where the federal government makes or does not make anything organic. It exists or does not exist in that state whether the feds have anything to do with it or not.
So, back to the subject, are sellers at the farmers market in Linton going to be allowed to claim to be organic if they are or do they have to have official status from USDA to make that claim?
eggs...traordinary conversation!!
This is eggs...actly what we needed!
I apologise: you are right still hopeful. I am just wasting my time with all this individual liberty and free thought nonsense. Obviously you are far and above intellectually stronger than any one here in the county. I say: still hopeful for dictator. Your witty name calling is the final proof of your dominance over all of us.
I agree, many farmers overuse antibiotics, especially penicillin. Most good, well-managed farms, use antibiotics to keep the livestock from dying when they are suceptible to illness. For example, when purchasing feeder cows, it is commonly recommended to vaccinate prior to relocation to a different farm(as a preventative to shipping fever). Also, poultry farmers often use amprollium as a broad spectrum antibiotic for the reasons I listed previously (primarily to prevent cocci and pneumonia)when they are introduced to other birds or a new facility. New chicks are even injected the day after hatching to promote growth and to build their titer against disease. Also, I would not be surprised if most 4-H animals are not given antibiotics to prevent infection from exposure to the different animals and waste at the fairgrounds. This is a smart management decision as long as the animal is not within the withdrawl date for slaughter.
There are very specific discontinuation dates (antibiotic free) for veterinary meds prior to slaughter, milk production and egg laying to prevent any chance of antibiotic resistance.
Also, your article is dated 2000. There, since, are many choices of alternative broad spectrum antibiotics available like biaxin, levaquin, zithromax and many more for use in IV therapy like Rocephin. Rocephin is a caphalosporin used primarily for pneumonia or other bacterial infections. It is labelled for IV use only and there are no equivelants to it in veterinary medicine.
There is much better management of livestock since these cases were brought forward, for good cause.
There is a much higher risk of a child having resistance due to parents who demand an antibiotic for their child every time they have a runny nose or a cold.
Unfortunately, our society tends to want an antibiotic prescription to help justify their visit to the doctor.
I guess if you don't think food is high enough now, then go ahead and feed the children organic stuff.
I would recommend a vigorous hand washing of all vegetables, especially those labelled organic as they have not, usually, been cleaned with the same treatments and rinse water as non-organic fruits and vegetables. There will also be a higher number of insects and fungi present.
Try this experiment: put a small baggie of salad mix (non-organic) in the frig next to the same size (organic) mix. Don't wash either one. The organic will likely degrade faster due to the presence of much more bacteria. If you have access to a school culture incubator and some agar dishes, take a sample from each and check out the diffeence in colonies and species in just 72 hours. Wash the food, especially when given to immunosuppressed people, children and the elderly.
Just take the money difference from organic to regular and buy stocks and bonds for your children. They will appreciate it much more in twenty years.
GCP, why feed the chickens antibiotics unless they are needed? There is a pretty big problem with antibotic overuse in farming relating to drug resistant disease in humans. There are several references to the CDC citing that MILLIONS of americans are affected yearly and thousands die.
ANTIBIOTICS POSE DANGERS
May 5, 2000
Montreal Gazette
Editorial / Op-ed
B2
Andrea Gilker, Sutton, writes in this letter to the editor: According to the
current New England Journal of Medicine, salmonella infection in a
12-year-old Nebraska boy proved immune to the drug Rocephine because of
indiscriminate use of a related antibiotic on his family's farm. The
Centres for Disease Control and Prevention was cited as saying that there
are no effective alternatives to Rocephine in treating children.
The growing immunity to antibiotics due to their excessive use in factory
farms has, according to this letter, raised the spectre of worldwide
epidemics. In fact, production and consumption of meat and other animal
products have been the chief source of food poisoning in the United States.
The CDC was cited as estimating that several million Americans are afflicted
each year and thousands are killed.
But routine use of antibiotics in animal feed is, according to this letter,
an integral element of today's animal agriculture. The meat and drug
industries have fiercely been cited as opposing attempts by the U.S. Food
and Drug Administration to limit this practice.
My guess is, america, you maybe a perfect example of pesticides and toxins soaking into the body and affecting brain function. Only child abusers support weaker child abuse laws, so you are actually pointing that finger at yourself. Innocent people have nothing to hide and don't fear false reports or 'investigations', since there is no truth in them. No clue who bud klien is but I'm sure he knows your calling from the shallow end of the gene pool, I won't worry.
Now what about feeding kids organic foods?
Rhode Island Red and Barred Rock chickens lay the best tasting eggs (in my opinion). Their yolks are bright yellow, almost orange, their shells are thicker and they keep longer than other breeds' eggs in the refrigerator.
Most chefs prefer them for their flavor and color just as the Amish use them for baking and for noodles.
The bottom line is: organic eggs are a rip-off due to the way they are marketed. They also are not raised differently than non-organic chickens (until they get sick and are seperated.) I hope there are some legitimate organic farmers out there, but even if they were they would not justify the price.
Range-free would taste better if they were actually free and offered clean corn/supplement diet with clean water just like the caged chickens. However, many range-free (actually yard runners) chickens do not recieve the carbs and nutrients needed and antibiotics to provide a great-tasting, disease-free eggs.
I feed my chickens a high quality egg layer feed, when laying, and a chick starter crumble with amprolium (antibiotics) after hatching for the first 6 months. This amprolium allows quicker weight gain, development and disease prevention when they are most vulnerable.
I would turn my hens loose in the yard were it not for my large, chicken-loving golden retriever.
...also we can not use that slogan. Brown county is already using it. They have a museum, campgrounds and festivals dedicated to the playing of that instrument.
It is wonderful music and that instrument is very complicated and takes years of dedicated study and practice to master it.
I suspect you of child rape "still hopeful" and I got ole bud kliens card right here in my hand.
Wow, if these comments weren't so sad, they'd be laughable. When this becomes a 'free country' to the point of allowing even SUSPECTED child rape to be ignored, there is big problem. Sexual abuse of minors is a horrific crime happening in our own community regularly. But alas, not too many seem to care muc about that either.
It's cult brainwashing that teaches childern like these NOT TO QUESTION AUTORITY-the idea of which was so scary to another poster-and leaves them vulnerable to quietly bearing abuse without speaking out. (Why not give a kid a valid reason for something if they question it...unless there is no valid reason?)
Is this all just a tad off topic? Or did I miss something and the alleged child abusing cult did organic farming?
Did Greene County ever chose a slogan? Based on columns and comments like these that make me think of something I read on another blog ; "Greene County Indiana; you can almost hear the banjo music'.
lol...no doubt brother.
...maybe I am wrong. link me to an article with statemnts from girls forced into marriage and I will gladly change my opinion. All I hear is the media slandering these people nightly, but I have yet to see any statement from any person who had been abused.
Ceteris Paribus, Habeus Corpus,e Sic Semper Tyrannis!
Maybe you forgot that this is the USA. Guilty until proven innocent.
They have not got any proof of that...I am not a bible beater by any means but people have rights. They can not even find this girl who made (supposedly) the phone call.
Personally I think they are wierdos, but this is a free country.
I just ran into this article too...environmental fears leading to mass global starvation!
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/main.jh...
Yeah let's talk about 14, 15, and 16-year-old girls being forced into marriage and having children.
What we should be questioning is why our government is kidnapping christian children in Eldorado, Texas.
I do question everything: includeing this "organic" food craze and all those animal rights nuts.
I am curious. Where do you draw your line on respecting authority? Where do you draw the line for your children?
The main problem with the children of today is they are listening to adults who tell them to "question everything".
I'm sure it is an attempt to just say something profound, but when I tell my child to do something , they should do it. No questions asked.
Does a Christian question God also?
Does a Muslim question Mohammad or Allah?
Probably not, unless they have a problem with respecting authority to begin with.
What one generation tolerates, the next one embraces.
What will your grandchildren do?
Is that me? No ruffled feathers here, just an opinion based on my experience and others I know. Take it or leave it, no problem there. Some people may honestly not know about the extreme toxins in our foods and waters. It's always good to consider all the facts when it comes to ones health, if you value it. Question everything. You maybe surprised at what you uncover.
Frankly though, it doesn't really matter in the big scheme of things. We are all going to die eventually, but's not rocket science to deduce that our life choices today stack the deck either in or out of our favor when it comes to 'natural selection'. If someone wants to stack the deck OUT of their favor, ok with me! I just prefer not to bring about any unnecessary physical suffering if I can avoid it, but that's just me and my crazy ideas! ;)
Knock yourself out with your own choices, makes no difference to this poster, enjoy!
Wow - somebody has the feathers all in a ruffle.
Anyone with any serious health 'issues' may be well served to 'try' the organic options and see if their health issues don't lessen or disappear completely.
One may find numerous books on the matter, one for church folk out there may open your eyes to some living saving truths, in 'Gods Way to Ultimate Health", By Dr.George Malkmus. http://www.hacres.com/home/home.asp
Also "A diet for a Small Planet" points out some pretty obvious problems and solutions.
Both those references are going to set off the people making money off mass produced food, of course, we'll see that shortly after posting.
Of course, there are those making money off of most of society's way of eating and even more people raking it in as our medical needs rise due to it and they will be quick to discredit anyone who threatens their livlihood, whether changing the way things are currently done could save lives or not.
Just not sure how anyone could chose to suffer ailments, including weight problems, without at least 'trying' an organic diet. Most people who do, find out fast that there IS a big difference.
For those who'd rather save a few bucks, eat processed and toxic substances, that's ok with me, but I don't understand the intense animosity with which those people react to the fact we are being offered OPTIONS and some are chosing the alternatives.
Take a look inside one of our local 'turkey farms' for a look inside how this 'product' is mass produced. Common sense tells us that if their environment isn't healthy for the animal one maybe eating, it's most likely not making a healthy product for you to eat.
Like with all human endeavor, there's always some inherent flaw. So goes it with organic foods and the marketing thereof. Personally, I wouldn't buy organic, or free range, or any other pricey egg due to my concerns of freshness. Finding a supplier I can trust is my problem, so I buy what moves the fastest. Yet in a world of druthers, I'd druther eat fresh brown eggs from the farm.
And bring on those Rhode Island Reds-yum!
Oh and I thought this was interesting.
http://www.enc-online.org/trivia.htm
Especially the third egg under egg production.
Oh you are funny. I really only comment so that I can play the devils advocate. Once again you wrote that your friend stated that there is no difference between an organic and a conventional chicken. Thus a chicken is a chicken. So why not just buy your "brown" eggs.
You are amazingly hypocritical and lie when convenient ( you however, are the one who bragged on another blog that YOU can have it both ways).
I invite all readers to read the entire blog and look for any quote from me that says a chicken is a chicken. If that were true then Perdue Farms would feed cornish hens to get grade A eggs. That way they would save money on feed and housing space.
A high quality laying hen (like Rhode Island Reds or Barred Rocks) produces brown eggs with much brighter yellow colored yolks with a higher protein, hence better flavor.
Better medicine is why we live longer.
Why ,if our food is so dangerous, is the average life span going up?
If all these new farming techniques are bad for us, why do we live longer?
American Indians lived completely organic and had a very limited life exspectancy.
We now live healthier than any civilization in history in any time or any place.
right? Or am I wrong..I dont care, I usually get the least exspensive egg because I am lucky to afford to eat.
My daughter is allergic to all fresh fruit. She breaks out with horrible fever blister all over her lips. 1/4 slice of watermelon rendered 22 blisters on her bottom lip.
However, she CAN eat organic fruit with no problem whatsoever.
Tell her there is no difference in the fruit....
You said it yourself. A chicken is a chicken. so therefore unless the diet is different, then an egg is an egg.
You cannot have it both ways.
To enlighten you, and probably you only, I prefer the eggs from Rhode Island Reds and barred Rocks as their yolks are richer and they taste better.
The last time I was at the grocery, eggs from those breeds was not a choice.
If you will read my comment more carefully, you would notice that the word "we" was used, which is all-inclusive.
Try not to reinforce the word ignorant any more with your comments.
You said that your friend the chicken farmer says there is no difference between his organic and conventional chickens. Yet you are raising your own chickens because the eggs taste better. And you called the rest of us ignorant.
This conversation just reinforces how ignorant Americans are and how easily duped we are.
Monday, I was in the grocery, standing in front of the eggs, of all places, amazed that they were $1.79/doz. The lady standing next to me had a cart full of pop, chips, and other processed foods (like TV dinners, cereals, cheeses, and canned goods). I noticed she did not pause in front of the eggs, reached up and grabbed a dozen of the organic eggs FOR $3.99/doz.
I don't know why her line in the sand starts with the magnificantly labeled organic eggs, but I suspect she has fallen for a line of garbage from some parnoid source as to the "agent orange", that the rest of the world eats and has up till a couple of years ago, put in the eggs for no reason (I don't think we need to de-forest our chicken coops).
People can buy whatever they want with their money. I, for one. like to know the farmer is using clean, healthy(herbicide and pesticide sprayed) corn, antibiotics when the birds are sick, delousing the birds with permithrin and using chlorinated water.
What the egg lady at the grocery did not think about is the hidden risks of her diet and diabetes or heart disease. Maybe she did think about it and just likes donating money to the invisible people behind the organic egg sign.
In the meantime, until my chickens begin laying, I totally trust that our food supply is safe.
PS I have a friend in Vincennes that sells organic eggs to the grocery. He states that in order to call them range-free, they must have 9 square feet of space (that's 3 feet X 3 feet square). It is not the rosey barnyard picture that is painted in the ads. He also says that there is no difference to the organic chickens he raises and the "non-organic"ones. They eat the same GMO corn, are in the same chicken houses and drink the same water. He just takes the sick "organic" chickens out and treats them with antibiotics and then throws them, when heathy again, into the regular stock. He does make more profit from the organically labelled eggs.
By the way, I raise my own eggs because they taste better.
I didn't mean to bad mouth farmers-I was raised on a farm. It's also what happens to the products once it leaves the farm!!!! It has very little nutrition by the time its processed & preserved!!! My husband died from Agent Orange-also know as Dioxin which has long been used in fertilzers!! Still is??
Okay, time for another 2-cents worth of my opinion. Folks, this organic farming business is a good thing. Suppy and demand will keep increasing, and more folks will return to backyard gardening, as well as supporting the local farmers market-which is a good thing in this world of Walmart supercenters. Everyone accepts the old saying that you are what you eat. So plant some goodies in your backyard (get your kids or nieces and nephews involved), buy from local veggie vendors, support your local butcher shop and keep your local economy, and your family healthy!
Organic foods are here to stay.
To mother2, help me. What are the farmers to do? Today's grain will not grow to produce a crop without the "stuff" The weed killers we use do NOT kill at the drop of a hat. That type of weed killer is what the home owner use to clean around your sidewalk. The fast acting brush killer was outlawed many years ago. Now there is a weed/grass killer that acts fast but not at the drop of a hat fast.
Yes Cancer is all around us. I am a city-slicker for the most part and the city pollution is choking me, that is what scares me regarding cancer. My family farm is not near as dangerous as my back yard here in Hamilton County.
We should be concerned and most farmers do have respect for the land they farm, if they did not it would shut them down because of poor practices.
Enough of my ramblings. Be good to each other.
I don't particularly care about how the weeds are pulled, I do care however about all the pesticides & preservatives that is being put in and on all the food. Does anyone ever think "Why is everyone getting Cancer?" Just think what all the chemicals can do--they kill weeds at the drop of a hat, can't you guess what's doing to your insides??????????? How about your children or grandchildren.???
Oh and the chance you are getting a Hoosier-farm raised hog are slim to none. That is unless you bought the hog from a local butcher shop which are also becoming slim to none.
From Wikipedia - "The main difference between free range and factory farmed eggs is that the birds are permitted to roam freely within the farmyard and only kept in sheds or henhouses at night."
You don't Easter egg hunt the eggs. They are laid in nests. The free-range refers to them being able to get exercise and a normal chicken diet of bugs, dirt, and chicken poop (because you know chickens aren't picky). Conventional chickens are kept cooped up and fed a standard diet of whatever the farmer deems necessary.
Nick-- my wife will purchase nothing but free range and the ect. stuff. I think back growing up on the farm we had organic cows,,, they fed off a pasture that was not enhanced. The offensive weeds were dug up by me and a shovel. (under Dad's direction) However in the winter they were moved to the barn and feed lot with corn and hay from our own fields. OK, the corn was fertilized.
I will meet you for some REAL eggs, taters, biscuts and gravy at breakfast next week.